Scary Movies: The Raven

It's October, and time for the annual Bruner horror movie festival! Our first movie this year is The Raven, the third Roger Corman-directed Edgar Allan Poe movie we've watched (last year I reviewed Tales of Terror and somehow neglected to review The Pit and the Pendulum). It will also probably be the last for a while, because we've now exhausted the Poe movies on our DVD collection.

The Raven is a horror-comedy, starring Vincent Price, Peter Lorre, Boris Karloff (!), and a very young Jack Nicholson (!!). The main character is Dr. Erasmus Craven, a magician of some power who lives a quiet life of drinking warm milk before bed and worrying over his teenage daughter, Estelle. He also mourns his late wife (Estelle's stepmother), Lenore. One evening, a raven taps on the window to his study, and when Dr. Craven lets it in, is surprised to find the raven speaking to him.

The raven is actually Dr. Bedlow, who was transformed into the raven in a wizard's duel with the evil Dr. Scarabus, and has come to Craven for help because they met at a wizard's convention some years back. The restored Dr. Bedlow sees a picture of the late Lenore and tells Dr. Craven he saw her at Scarabus's house that very evening. Bedlow and Craven decide to pay Scarabus a visit--Bedlow wanting revenge for losing the duel, and Craven to find out if Scarabus has somehow imprisoned the spirit of his beloved Lenore. What they find at Scarabus's castle will surprise them both, and viewer as well.

This movie was fun from start to finish, well-paced and never flagging in interest. I can't say the humor was hilarious or the scares were very frightening, but the various wizards' duels, unexpected magical transformations, and double crosses kept my interest and my childrens' as well. We'll rate this at the high end of Okay on the rating scale.

The Raven (1963)

Story/Plot/Characters--Fine acting and a great script with extra points for originality. Characters were somewhat stereotyped, but overall well-done. (3 points)
Special Effects-- Dated, although they must have been something in 1963. (1 point)
Scariness--Well, zero. Not scary at all. As a horror-comedy, maybe I should be rating this on humor, then. A nice jovial atmosphere, but specific jokes were pretty lame--this was no Young Frankenstein. (.5 points)
Atmosphere/Freakiness--Scarabus's castle was pretty cool, with its elaborate, floating fire braziers. (1 point)
Total=5.5 points (Okay)

______________________________________________________________________________
Here's the master list of horror movies I've rated so far. (Click the title for a link to a review of the movie.)

Excellent
Alien (1979)=10 points
Day of the Dead (1978)=9.5 points
Bride of Frankenstein (1935)=8.5 points
A Quiet Place (2018)=8.5 points
Frankenstein (1931)=8 points
King Kong (1933)=8 points
Village of the Damned (1960)=8 points
Night of the Living Dead (1968)=7.5 points
Carrie (1976)=7.5 points
Jaws (1975)=7 points
Pretty Good
Witch: A New England Folktale (2015)=6.5 points
Aliens (1986)=6.5 points
The Birds (1963)=6.5 points
Carnival of Souls (1962)=6.5 points
Night Creatures (1962)=6.5 points
Phantom of the Opera (1962)=6.5 points
The Thing (1982)=6 points
Tales of Terror (1962)=6 points
Okay
The Raven (1963)=5.5 points
The House on Haunted Hill (1959)=5 points
Gremlins (1984)=5 points
Lady Frankenstein (1971)=4.5 points
Man-Thing (2005)=4 points
Creature From the Black Lagoon (1954)=3.5 points
Avoid
Alien 3 (1992)=3 points
The Wolf Man (1941)=3 points
The Last Man on Earth (1964)=2 points

What I'm Reading: The Mote in God's Eye

Now this is a great science fiction novel, and simultaneously an illustration of the limits of genre fiction. The Mote in God's Eye, by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle, succeeds at every level as an SF story. The primary character in a very large cast is Captain Blaine of the Imperial Space Navy, who leads an expedition to the Mote, a remote corner of the galaxy where humans, whose empire spans hundreds of worlds, have detected the first intelligence alien species they've ever encountered.

Upon arrival in the system, the humans encounter the Moties, as they come to be known. The Moties are shorter than humans and furry, but essentially human-like, with some notable biological differences--a large, strong left arm and two slender but dextrous right arms, for example. The Moties have tens of thousands of years of history and incredibly advanced technology, but have never expanded beyond their home planet and moons due to a weird circumstance. In this book, faster-than-light space travel is only possible through wormholes that have a single destination--and the only wormhole in the Motie's system leads straight to the heart of a supernova. Every attempt they've made to explore deep space has ended in disaster.

The Moties are friendly enough, eager to learn about humans, and seemingly open about themselves. Theirs is a peaceful society, although rather caste-bound. Different types of Moties have different jobs--engineers, doctors, farmers--not just by avocation or ability, but because they're actually genetically-engineered for the role. Farmers have thick fingers for dealing with soil but aren't too bright, porters are huge and muscle-bound but positively stupid, doctors have long, delicate fingers for surgery, messengers have well-developed legs for running and an ability to memorize long messages. The ones of most concern to humans are the mediators, who are intelligent and good with languages (they pick up English in a matter of days) but utterly unable to make decisions on their own. It is the mediators, whose job is to settle disputes between conflicting parties, who are responsible for the centuries of peace that have passed on their planet, and also who befriend the human visitors.

Yet the mediators have a reticence to discuss certain topics, and although their world has avoided war for centuries, there are strange holes when they discuss their history. Not that they're covering anything up--but that they don't know. Carefully recorded histories going back millenia, but with gaps they can't explain. It turns out the Moties have a secret--one that will affect their relationship with the human race in an unforeseen way.

Like I said, this is a great science fiction novel, a realistic account of what an encounter between humanity and an intelligent alien species might be like. It's a long book (nearly 600 pages) but fascinating on almost every page, with tons of great details about the Moties, the human ships, space travel, and the nature of the human empire hundreds of years in the future. I heartily recommend it for SF lovers.

But not for anybody else. Because as great as it is as science fiction, it's highly mediocre by the standards of mainstream literature. The writing is professional and effective, but rarely more than functional. Dialogue too is functional, and though a couple characters have stereotypical accents (Scottish, Russian), everybody pretty much speaks the same way. No characters are fully-rounded people, and beyond Captain Blaine and one or two others, most are strictly two-dimensional. A romance between Captain Blaine and a female anthropologist on his ship, Sandra Fowler, is almost comically bad.

So this is no Ray Bradbury or Robert Heinlein, transcending the genre of SF with gorgeous writing and brilliant characters. It's rare to encounter a book that so fully exemplifies the merits of its genre, but without fulfilling any literary aspirations beyond the genre conventions, or even trying to.

Ranking: Man of Steel

Man of Steel came out in 2013, and if I remember, it was critically panned at the time. I watched it recently with my son, and we enjoyed it pretty well! Not the greatest comic movie I've ever seen but perfectly entertaining. I rank this one at the high end of Okay.

It retells the origin of Superman, with the villain being General Zod and his fellow Kryptonian criminals from the Phantom Zone. It worked fine on both scores. Where I think a lot of critics disliked the movie is because it did not have Christopher Reeve, the Superman from the 1970s-80s movies, who brought a palpable warmth and sense of goodness and dignity to the role. Superman in this movie (and in the DC shared-universe movies since) is played by Henry Cavill, a buff man who certainly looks the part of Superman, but comes across as rather bland. Nothing wrong with him, but he doesn't seem to bring much personality to the role. Nevertheless, the movie is fine to watch if you want to pass a couple pleasant hours.

I have previously ranked Avengers: Infinity War, the Avengers movies, the Batman movies, Black Panther, Captain America: Civil War, Dr. Strange, Guardians of the Galaxy 2, Logan, the Man-Thing, the non-Marvel and non-DC comic movies, the other DC movies, the Spider-Man movies, the summer 2015 comic movies, the Superman movies, Thor: Ragnarok, Wonder Woman, and the X-Men movies.


As ever, my ranking system is
Green=excellent  Blue=pretty good  Black=Okay  Red=avoid

_______________________________________________________________________________

Here's the master list of all comics movies I've rated so far, in order from best to worst:

Crumb
American Splendor
Iron Man
Heavy Metal (1981)
Spider-Man 2 (2004)
Avengers
Superman (1978)
Captain America
Wonder Woman (2017)
Batman Begins (2005)
Captain America: Civil War
Captain America 2: The Winter Soldier
Spider-Man (2002)
X-Men 2: X-Men United
X-Men: Days of Future Past
Superman II
Batman (1989)
Ant-Man
Guardians of the Galaxy (2014)
Thor: Ragnarok (2017)
Dr. Strange
The Dark Knight (2008)
Logan (2017)
Iron Man 3
The Wolverine (2013)
Guardians of the Galaxy 2
Sin City (2005)
X-Men: First Class
X-Men (2000)
Black Panther
Man of Steel (2013)
Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers 2: Age of Ultron
Swamp Thing (1982)
Spider-Man 3 (2007)
Iron Man 2
Watchmen (2009)
Batman Forever (1995)
Superman Returns (2006)
Thor 2: The Dark World
Incredible Hulk (2008)
Mystery Men (1999)
Dark Knight Rises (2012)
Man-Thing (2005)
Superman III
Supergirl (1984)
Thor
X-Men 3: Last Stand
Hulk (2003)
Fritz the Cat (1972)
Batman and Robin (1997)
Batman Returns (1992)
Superman IV

Amazing Spider-Man (2012) (Haven't seen)
Amazing Spider-Man 2 (2014) (Haven't seen)
Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017) (Haven't seen)
Batman (1966) (Haven't seen)
Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice (Haven't seen)
Catwoman (Haven't seen)
Constantine (Haven't seen)
Deadpool (Haven't seen)
Green Lantern (Haven't seen)
Hellboy (Haven't seen)
Judge Dredd (Haven't seen)
Sin City: A Dame to Kill For (2014) (Haven't seen)
V for Vendetta (Haven't seen)
X-Men Origins: Wolverine (Haven't seen)

Ranking: Avengers: Infinity War

Avengers: The Infinity War is what the Marvel movies have been building up to for many years. Hints about the villain, Thanos, have been seeded in movies going back at least to the first Avengers movie in 2012, and maybe farther (?).

Thanos is a titan, a sort of celestial being whose daughters, the good Gamora and the evil Nebula, have played big parts in the Guardians of the Galaxy movies. He's trying to collect the six Infinity Stones, jewels of immense power that embody certain fundamental aspects of the universe--power, reality, time, space, mind, and soul. Once he finds them all and inserts them in his glove, the Infinity Gauntlet, he'll have complete control over every aspect of the universe. His plan once he's achieved this? To kill half of all things, thus eliminating poverty, misery, and famine, for the remaining living beings will have plenty of resources. After that, he'll simply retire to a nice planet and watch the sun rise in the mornings.

We've seen many of the infinity stones in Marvel movies before--the Mind stone, for instance, is embedded in the Vision and gives him life. The Time stone is part of Dr. Strange's Eye of Agamotto, a magical artifact. And so forth. Much of the movie concerns the Avengers and their attempt to keep Thanos from acquiring the stones.

And to stop him, they need help--a lot of help! In fact, nearly every hero introduced in the Marvel Cinematic Universe makes an appearance, including the Guardians of the Galaxy, Dr. Strange, Spider-Man, Black Panther, and many others. And did all these heroes succeed in stopping Thanos? Um, no, actually. But they'll get another chance next summer in Avengers: Infinity War, Part Two.

This was a fun movie, and I admire the way it managed to give nearly every Marvel character something meaningful to do. After a while, though, it was all too much. I mean, it didn't feel quite as disjointed as one might think, considering all the characters--but it was still pretty disjointed. I think we'll rank this one as only Okay.

I have previously ranked the Batman movies, the Superman movies, the other DC movies, the Avengers movies, the X-Men movies, the summer 2015 comic movies, the Spider-Man movies, the non-Marvel and non-DC comic movies, Black Panther, Captain America: Civil War, Dr. Strange, Guardians of the Galaxy 2, Logan, the Man-Thing, Thor: Ragnarok, and Wonder Woman.


As ever, my ranking system is
Green=excellent  Blue=pretty good  Black=Okay  Red=avoid

_______________________________________________________________________________

Here's the master list of all comics movies I've rated so far, in order from best to worst:

Crumb
American Splendor
Iron Man
Heavy Metal (1981)
Spider-Man 2 (2004)
Avengers
Superman (1978)
Captain America
Wonder Woman (2017)
Batman Begins (2005)
Captain America: Civil War
Captain America 2: The Winter Soldier
Spider-Man (2002)
X-Men 2: X-Men United
X-Men: Days of Future Past
Superman II
Batman (1989)
Ant-Man
Guardians of the Galaxy (2014)
Thor: Ragnarok (2017)
Dr. Strange
The Dark Knight (2008)
Logan (2017)
Iron Man 3
The Wolverine (2013)
Guardians of the Galaxy 2
Sin City (2005)
X-Men: First Class
X-Men (2000)
Black Panther
Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers 2: Age of Ultron
Swamp Thing (1982)
Spider-Man 3 (2007)
Iron Man 2
Watchmen (2009)
Batman Forever (1995)
Superman Returns (2006)
Thor 2: The Dark World
Incredible Hulk (2008)
Mystery Men (1999)
Dark Knight Rises (2012)
Man-Thing (2005)
Superman III
Supergirl (1984)
Thor
X-Men 3: Last Stand
Hulk (2003)
Fritz the Cat (1972)
Batman and Robin (1997)
Batman Returns (1992)
Superman IV

Amazing Spider-Man (2012) (Haven't seen)
Amazing Spider-Man 2 (2014) (Haven't seen)
Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017) (Haven't seen)
Batman (1966) (Haven't seen)
Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice (Haven't seen)
Catwoman (Haven't seen)
Constantine (Haven't seen)
Deadpool (Haven't seen)
Green Lantern (Haven't seen)
Hellboy (Haven't seen)
Judge Dredd (Haven't seen)
Man of Steel (Haven't seen)
Sin City: A Dame to Kill For (2014) (Haven't seen)
V for Vendetta (Haven't seen)
X-Men Origins: Wolverine (Haven't seen)

What I'm Reading: Full of Beans

Beans lives in Key West, Florida, during the Depression, where every kid and adult seems to have a nickname. In fact, that's about all they have, because the Depression has hit Key West hard, and there are no jobs or money available. The cigar-rolling factories have laid off most of their workers, including Beans's dad, who's gone up north in search of work. So when local rum runner Johnny Cakes offers 11-year-old Beans a dollar to help deliver illicit liquor around the neighborhood, Beans takes him up on it. After all, he's not really hurting anybody, is he?

But then Johnny Cakes offers Beans some real money, if he's willing to do something Beans thinks is really wrong. And now Beans has a decision to make, because his dad hasn't found a job up north yet, and there's a new baby in the house, and his family could really use some cash.

That's the premise behind Jennifer Holm's Full of Beans, a great book with lots of local color. Holm definitely did her research, because there are tons of fascinating details about life in Key West in the 1930s--everything from the leper colony living on the island to the Shirley Temple movies playing at the local cinema, and of course, the visiting New Deal representatives from Washington, who are trying to clean Key West up and make it into a tourist destination despite the impoverishment (and highly skeptical attitudes) of the local population.

I hope I didn't make Beans's situation sound too grim, because this book is pretty hilarious throughout. From his gang, the Keepsies (so-called because they're the best marble players in Key West, and they play for keeps), to the crazy people who live in the neighborhood, to the addled ways the New Deal representatives try to improve the community, there are plenty of funny characters and situations. It's aimed at late elementary school students and perhaps middle schoolers, but I think this book has enough humor and historical detail to interest all kinds of readers.

Ranking: Logan

I'm falling behind on ranking my comic book movies! I have two I haven't gotten to, and I haven't even seen Ant-Man & the Wasp yet. So let's start with the oldest one, Logan, which my son and I watched on DVD last weekend.

You know Logan, right? The real name of Wolverine, the gruff, unshaven guy with claws, unbreakable bones, and an ability to heal from wounds almost instantaneously? In this movie, the year is 2029, and mutants like Logan have been hunted down (perhaps as a result of the events in X-Men: Days of Future Past?) and are either dead or living in hiding. Logan lives in El Paso where he keeps a low profile, driving a rental limo for money. When he has time and spare cash, he visits Professor X, the telepath and former leader of the X-Men, now a doddering old man who suffers from epileptic fits that make his psychic powers go out of control. Professor X lives in an abandoned factory out in the desert with his caretaker Caliban, an albino mutant who can't go out in the sunlight.

A Mexican lady and her 8-year-old daughter, Lara, have somehow tracked Logan down and asked him for help, but he doesn't have time or inclination to help random people, even though the sight of the girl somehow makes him uneasy. It turns out they're being hunted by the Reavers, a pack of humans enhanced with robotic body parts, who want to capture the girl and bring her in. When they figure out Logan is connected, they raid Professor X's place, and Logan must fight. It turns out the girl has claws and a healing factor, too, as well as an attitude almost as bad as Logan's, and together they manage to escape in the limo, with Professor X in the backseat.

Now the girl and Professor X want Logan to drive them to a refuge for mutants in Canada. Logan doesn't believe the place really exists, but he doesn't have anything left for him in El Paso, and he does feel a strange connection to this young girl with powers so similar to his, so they set off on a road trip. What is the girl's story? And can they make it to the alleged refuge before the Reavers catch up to them?

This was a pretty good movie, but not for kids. With plenty of bad language and really bloody violence, it earns its R rating. For those who know Wolverine in the comics, think less John Byrne and more Frank Miller. So I can't exactly recommend it for kids, but for teens and adults, it's highly entertaining, well-scripted and well-acted. In my ranking system, it comes out as pretty good.

I have previously ranked the Batman movies, the Superman movies, the other DC movies, the Avengers movies, the X-Men movies, the summer 2015 comic movies, the Spider-Man movies, the non-Marvel and non-DC comic movies, Black Panther, Captain America: Civil War, Dr. Strange, Guardians of the Galaxy 2, the Man-Thing, Thor: Ragnarok, and Wonder Woman.


As ever, my ranking system is
Green=excellent  Blue=pretty good  Black=Okay  Red=avoid

_______________________________________________________________________________

Here's the master list of all comics movies I've rated so far, in order from best to worst:

Crumb
American Splendor
Iron Man
Heavy Metal (1981)
Spider-Man 2 (2004)
Avengers
Superman (1978)
Captain America
Wonder Woman (2017)
Batman Begins (2005)
Captain America: Civil War
Captain America 2: The Winter Soldier
Spider-Man (2002)
X-Men 2: X-Men United
X-Men: Days of Future Past
Superman II
Batman (1989)
Ant-Man
Guardians of the Galaxy (2014)
Thor: Ragnarok (2017)
Dr. Strange
The Dark Knight (2008)
Logan (2017)
Iron Man 3
The Wolverine (2013)
Guardians of the Galaxy 2
Sin City (2005)
X-Men: First Class
X-Men (2000)
Black Panther
Avengers 2: Age of Ultron
Swamp Thing (1982)
Spider-Man 3 (2007)
Iron Man 2
Watchmen (2009)
Batman Forever (1995)
Superman Returns (2006)
Thor 2: The Dark World
Incredible Hulk (2008)
Mystery Men (1999)
Dark Knight Rises (2012)
Man-Thing (2005)
Superman III
Supergirl (1984)
Thor
X-Men 3: Last Stand
Hulk (2003)
Fritz the Cat (1972)
Batman and Robin (1997)
Batman Returns (1992)
Superman IV

Amazing Spider-Man (2012) (Haven't seen)
Amazing Spider-Man 2 (2014) (Haven't seen)
Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017) (Haven't seen)
Batman (1966) (Haven't seen)
Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice (Haven't seen)
Catwoman (Haven't seen)
Constantine (Haven't seen)
Deadpool (Haven't seen)
Green Lantern (Haven't seen)
Hellboy (Haven't seen)
Judge Dredd (Haven't seen)
Man of Steel (Haven't seen)
Sin City: A Dame to Kill For (2014) (Haven't seen)
V for Vendetta (Haven't seen)
X-Men Origins: Wolverine (Haven't seen)

What I'm Reading: Conversations of Socrates

After his execution in 400 BC, lots of Socrates' friends and students wrote accounts of him, but the writings of only two of those authors survive today: Plato, with more than 20 dialogues "starring" his old teacher, and Xenophon, with four accounts (although Xenophon also has other surviving, but non-Socratic, works). (I've previously written on some of Plato's works here, here, and here.)

Xenophon's four accounts are collected in the book Conversations of Socrates. The first is the Defense of Socrates, which is the briefest one and consists of Xenophon defending the arrogant tone Socrates took at his trial. As Xenophon explains it, Socrates believed the gods had already ordained he should die following the trial, and moreover believed the best time for a man to die was at the very beginning of old age, as he was, when he has all the accomplishments of his life to look back on, but the infirmities of age have not yet occurred. So in Socrates' mind, there was no reason to mount a standard legal defense begging the jury for his life, but felt free to make a vigorous justification of his life and actions, no matter what impression on the jury his words might make.

His second account is the Memoirs, and is the largest part of the book. The Memoirs consists of four parts, each with about eight to ten chapters, each chapter containing a little anecdote about the life of Socrates or a conversation he had. Most of these anecdotes or conversations have something of a moral or instructive purpose--Socrates explaining how to be a good friend, or telling a young man how to become a good orator, or similar. I think my favorite is his conversation with his son, Lamprocles, who I suppose is ten or eleven, and has gotten in an argument with his mother. Rather than yelling at or chiding his son, Socrates leads him through one of his little questioning dialogues (i.e., the Socratic method), using his son's own answers to help him reach the conclusion that he should be respectful of his mother.

The third account is the Dinner-Party, about a boozy get-together Socrates took part in with a number of friends on a holiday where they discuss the meaning of love. This is similar enough to Plato's Symposium that they clearly describe the same evening, yet Xenophon's recounting includes a somewhat different cast of characters and the content of the conversations are fairly different as well. Moreover, though Xenophon claims to have been present (I believe Plato merely claims to have heard about the dinner second-hand), the cast of characters is such that he would have to have been a small child, and it seems unlikely the adults would have let him stay in the room for their drinking and sometimes bawdy conversation. But it's fairly entertaining, and at a couple points we get the rare spectacle of his friends making fun of Socrates for his questioning method of conversing--replying "Certainly" in unison to a string of his questions even when that answer doesn't make sense.

The final account is the Estate-Manager, which is in two parts: in the first, Critobulus discusses with his friend Socrates his plan to buy a farm and how he should run it, and in the second, Socrates recounts the time he spoke to Ischomachus, a wealthy man, about the best way to run a farm. The topic may sound a little dry, but it is actually fascinating for it tells the reader a lot about how Greeks lived their day to day lives. Especially interesting is that Ischomachus considers having a good wife to be the most important aspect of managing an estate, and explains how he and his wife divide up their duties in the house and decide, for instance, where to store excess grain or how to reward a slave who does a good job.

The translator of the book, Robin Waterfield, brings up a question that I would like to discuss a bit. He points out that Xenophon's Socrates is somewhat different than Plato's Socrates--less purely philosophical, more concerned with giving good advice to his friends than in considering abstract concepts, perhaps earthier in his vocabulary. He suggests three explanations for this. The first, and the one that a lot of critics have gone with, is that Xenophon is somehow "wrong" in his description of Socrates, and Plato is "right," and thus we can pretty much dismiss Xenophon.

The second explanation, and the one I prefer, is that Socrates was a sophisticated speaker who talked with different people in different ways. To a young, educated aristocrat like Plato, he would talk about the nature of reality or the definition of justice or similar things. To a veteran soldier and landowner like Xenophon, he would discuss more practical matters like managing a farm or running for office, and using a more down-to-earth conversational style. It's not like Plato and Xenophon describe a vastly different man--they clearly are both writing about the same person, who could adjust his style and subject-matter for his audience.

The final explanation is that these are works of fiction though using an actual historical figure, so if Plato writes him one way, and Xenophon another, it has nothing to do with the real person because they're just stories. Note how in the Dinner-Party Xenophon claimed to have been present though that would have been highly implausible, or that both Xenophon and Plato describe the same party but none of the details reconcile. Or note how in Plato's later writings, especially the Republic, Socrates makes smooth, elaborate, chapter-long arguments in speech that seem rather unlikely to have actually occurred. Waterfield also points that Aristotle, who knew Plato personally, classifies the various Socratic dialogues as fiction in his catalog of literature. I must admit, I rather dislike this final explanation. There may have been details that Xenophon and Plato adjusted to make for a better story, but I find it hard to believe that most of what they wrote about Socrates wasn't true in some sense. Even if the words that reach us aren't precisely the way he really spoke them, I do think that in the works of Xenophon and Plato, Socrates is speaking to us across the ages.